Digging at Hiddenite | Dirty Rockhounds (2024)

Post by fayncfaceter on May 8, 2008 5:54:13 GMT -5

Post by lauriesrocks on May 8, 2008 7:54:49 GMT -5

I must assume you are referring to the tourist trap when you say "the Hiddenite Mine", as there are many mines at Hiddenite. I have such a profoundly negative opinion of this "mine" that I will not comment on what you may or may not find there. I would however like to comment on the term "ore". I am of the opinion that this term should be, and overwhelmingly is, used to denote metallic mineral deposits, and the origin of the term reinforces this belief. Ores generally contain one or more metals in profitable concentrations that can be smelted or processed. The term has been used very rarely for non metallic deposits, such as sulpher, but this is when the profitable mineral is disseminated within the rock and has to be extracted through a chemical and/or mechanical process. I believe in this case of gem deposits such as at Hiddenite, the term should probably be "host rock" or matrix rather than ore. Of course there is no cut and dried rule one way or another and some will no doubt disagree with me, but this is just my personal opinion. At Hiddenite, there is no single easily recognizable host rock per se in which the emeralds or hiddenite occur. It can be a combination of several minerals, such as quartz, calcite, siderite, muscovite, and often clay. Those with much experience at Hiddenite can recognize favorable looking zones and veins, but it takes a while to learn this. At the salted "mines" it is doubtful that you would ever be digging in "virgin" ground that has not already been dug. Even this ground may well be salted. I do not want to discourage you, quite the contrary. The more accurate your knowledge the more likely you will have success. Unless you dig down into unaltered hard rock, you will be exploiting quartz/mica veins in saprolite, usually with considerable clay in which the emeralds may be imbedded. In short, look for quartz and/or mica veins. Good luck!

Post by fayncfaceter on May 11, 2008 8:43:13 GMT -5

Post by amythestguy on May 11, 2008 9:45:41 GMT -5

I saw that the gem Hiddenite also comes from Afganistan. I was under the impression that it only came from NC. Whats the difference? Maybe it's because it was discovered in NC. I asked about Hiddenite at the gem show on Friday and nobody had any but they all wanted to get their hands on some.

Post by fayncfaceter on May 11, 2008 10:06:10 GMT -5

There is some argument about the green variety of Spodumene. The Hiddenite in NC is colored by chromium. Brazil spodumene is colored by Iron. Now comes the argument....should all spodumene colored green by chromium be considered Hiddenite or should that name be reserved for the NC species?
The world may never know.

Post by colorshapetexture on May 11, 2008 10:34:15 GMT -5

Dig Dug has the Scoop ( HA HA ) on Hiddenite. Save your gas money for the JXR or whatever. You can mine about the same "ORE" lol right at home. Just ask Laurie to make you up a $50.00 bucket and he will have the mail man deliver it. And I bet it will have facet grade material valued at well over the $50.00. +shipping and handling.
Realy if you want a chance of at least finding a native specimen of North Carolina Emerald go to the Crabtree mine. That is as close as you will get to Ore. You can see and learn how and what the crystals form in. It is the tailings at least, of a real Emerald mine.
Email Steve Barr for permission to enter the Crabtree Mine. MAGMA manages it.
. Jim

Post by stevebarr on May 11, 2008 13:53:40 GMT -5

The chemical composition of real Hiddenite is different from anything found elsewhere in the world. The other "Hiddenite" that you're seeing for sale is actually only called that because it increases the asking price.

Post by amythestguy on May 11, 2008 19:00:54 GMT -5

Thats what I had heard, steve. I saw an ad for Afgan hiddenite and I was unclear as to whether it was like the NC variety.

Post by lauriesrocks on May 12, 2008 11:37:10 GMT -5

I am at the point where I don't think I'll ever post on this forum again. I wasn't slapping you down, I just thought you might appreciate my understanding of the term. Seems like every time I post on here, someone gets offended. So I'll keep my opinions to myself from now on.

Post by colorshapetexture on May 12, 2008 12:12:29 GMT -5

Laurie, No Way!
I didn't get that. He was just bowing to your expertise. Heck no one in their right mine (He He), would dought your history in NC Gem collecting and general been there and done that. You probably sell more stones in a week than I will ever collect. Jim

Post by kap on May 12, 2008 12:56:32 GMT -5

Laurie, I agree with Jim please keep posting I enjoy reading your posts and find them very informative.
Keith

Post by stevebarr on May 12, 2008 14:18:37 GMT -5

Post by tomleary on May 12, 2008 16:57:13 GMT -5

I agree with Laurie and Steve,
I am not happy unless I can dig in "in place" minerals in Matrix. It is a whole lot of fun to break a rock open and see what has never been seen by anyone before.
I went to a :oBUCKET SHACK as a kid and had a pretty good time until I started finding sawed up bits of aquamarine. I asked how it got in the buckets and the attendant swore up and down it was a native anomaly. I could tell it was clearly cut up trimmings. I will not tell who it was doing this as I do not mean anyone harm and it was NOT emerald hollow. (it was not 15 miles from crabtree hint hint )
These places serve their own niche in the market for tourists but are not good for native ore/matrix. They do need to be honest and tell what the terms "salted, larded, concentrated, graded ore," etc. really mean.
A good friend Bill once told me "something is only worth what people will pay for it" so the value they put on things is only arbitrary.
A good example of a rockhound friendly place that salts is Morefield Mine in Va. They have a lot of good material they actually honestly bring up from the mine. It is really native but they do throw quartz points and amethyst and topaz from Brazil in there. It is for the kids to find good stuff and make them happy. I even took a few truckloads of trimmings from my collecting to Sam while he was open so the material would not go to waste and it would be appreciated by anyone finding it.
A rockhound like me has the rare earths /tantalite ore to find and an occasional amazonite hunk that decidedly came from there. There is also the trench to dig in the actual pegmatite for beryls and Mica.
What I am saying is that a mine can be salted but has to have good native material/ digging balance and be honest about what is NOT from there. I hope the new owners of Morefield will be good custodians as well. It is a good place I hate to lose.
Happy hunting everyone!

Post by tomleary on May 12, 2008 17:01:42 GMT -5

Oh By the way, the good ore from Emerald hollow is large Mica crystal clusters sometimes with rutile in them. I did hit a small seam while there a few years ago and found a bucket or so worth of it. No emeralds to speak of but it was the type of vein/seam that would offer the environment to produce a few.

Post by lauriesrocks on May 12, 2008 18:08:08 GMT -5

Okay, here I am posting again. And it's because of the tremendous outpouring of support I have recieved from all you great folks, both on the public and private forums. Thanks so much everyone! About this nomenclature thing, perhaps I could have explained things better. Look at it this way. Since the emeralds and hiddenite are generally found in quartz/mica veins and pods, should we call quartz and mica emerald ore? Considering that 99.9999% of all quartz/mica veins in the world do NOT contain emeralds or hiddenite, it would be very erroneous and misleading to call quartz and mica emerald ore. Chalcopyrite is copper ore whether it occurs in Peru or North Carolina, Bauxite is tin ore wherever it occurs. Quartz and mica are only "hosts" of emeralds at a couple places in the world. This is where I see the limitations of the use of the term "ore". There is no need for fancyfaceter or anyone else to apologize for using this term, it's no big deal. I simply wanted to share my understanding of these relative terms. I have a tendency to speak my mind, but perhaps I can be more diplomatic in the future, and not try to come off as some kind of "know-it-all". Hell. I don't know anything! There are countless collectors, dealers, mineralogists, etc. that know a great deal more than I do, and they often correct me and educate me. I welcome this input, I am not offended by it, but I can understand how some may feel like I'm trying to be a smartass. I am not. I WILL continue to post on this forum, thanks to your gracious tolerance, and if I ever offend anyone in the future, please don't take it personally, I just sometimes don't express myself as well as I should. I love you guys, let's keep rockin'! As for the salted mine thing, I agree with most of you that if a salted mine turns a kid (or an adult) on to rockhounding, then that's great! I do believe they should be honest about it though. There is way too much dumbing down of all things science as it is. Us rockhounds should know better. Thanks, Laurie.

Post by CKB69 on May 12, 2008 21:28:50 GMT -5

Post by fayncfaceter on May 13, 2008 5:28:22 GMT -5

Post by reverenddeb on May 13, 2008 13:33:52 GMT -5

Laurie, I thought I was the one who got shot down the most when posting. We'll have to vie for the "shot at" world title!

Post by buckeye on May 14, 2008 0:24:58 GMT -5

Post by fayncfaceter on May 14, 2008 6:11:55 GMT -5

Must be...I guess I can live with whatever people call me as long as it's not late for supper.

Post by capnbob on May 20, 2008 23:09:08 GMT -5

Are their other places to dig at Hiddenite? We tried digging at Emerald Hollow (The Home of Gemstone Bingo) and found nothing but a few Quartz crystals. All they give you for tools is a standard shovel and a 5 gallon bucket and they won't let you dig anywhere where there is anything to be found. GIANT RIP OFF!

Post by scott on May 21, 2008 7:18:50 GMT -5

When we see that someone has gotten incorrect information or using a term incorrectly I think we should chime in and enlighten this individual. This is one of the perks of this forum. We shouldn't see it as a condescending slap but more as someone giving you a helping hand. If information has somehow been corrupted then the person with this information will probably spread it on to others who will now also be misinformed. We should all be good custodians of true knowledge.

Post by DigDug on May 21, 2008 11:18:33 GMT -5

AH, dont get me started about Hiddenite....LOL. There is another thread regarding new regulations there with the EPA inspection done there recently.